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Topic: Time to find a new Pope
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AcidWarp
Sarge
Member # 997
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posted 04-04-2005 04:46 AM
    
Cac, you won't offend me. I had a great deal of respect for the pope yes, but I wasn't blind. I know that he was still a follower of his religion, and all the hipocracy therein. But that doesn't mean you can't respect him. I respected Mother Teresa the same way, and she was as much a Catholic as the Pope.And fess, Willy is right, too soon. Funny though  (personally, Vatican Idol is what I would call it) [ 04-04-2005: Message edited by: AcidWarp ] -------------------- “I have noticed even people who claim everything is predestined, and that we can do nothing to change it, look before they cross the road.” “Intelligence is the ability to adapt to change.” --Dr. Stephen Hawking.
Posts: 4363 | From: Waterloo, Ontario | Registered: Nov 1999 | IP: Logged
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AcidWarp
Sarge
Member # 997
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posted 04-06-2005 03:37 AM
All those are true Cac, and you'll never see me deny it. But I respected his constant struggle for peace in the world. To him, war and violence and death were never justified.-------------------- “I have noticed even people who claim everything is predestined, and that we can do nothing to change it, look before they cross the road.” “Intelligence is the ability to adapt to change.” --Dr. Stephen Hawking.
Posts: 4363 | From: Waterloo, Ontario | Registered: Nov 1999 | IP: Logged
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WillyTrombone
Sarge
Member # 27
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posted 04-06-2005 04:48 AM
I don't believe that he was the greatest man alive in the 20th century. There were others who did more political good than the pope, from offices of more relevance and there were others who did more to advance humanity in other ways. But what did make this pope great was that he reminded us just what separates humanity from the animal kingdom, and a recurrent piece of that was that sexuality is a matter of procreation and unification. Many of his writings refer to that principle and many of the things for which most of his detractors cite him are a direct result of that belief. First, the loudest criticism is of his position against sending condoms to Africa. Condoms have not helped significantly in Africa. There is a cultural and educational problem present and the pope's full position was that if human civilization is to fluorish in Africa, properties of civilized behovior need to be adopted, and that include sexual morality. Given that there are some parts of Africa in which it is believed that raping and infant will cure AIDS, it is easily demonstrable that the levels of education in the matters of biology are inadequate for such a problem as complex as the AIDS epidemic to be overcome by a solution as simple as throwing money (condoms) at it. There is a need for cultural advancement and THAT is what he proposed. And in fact, the most effective anti-AIDS program in African has been the one in place in Uganda, which, rather than passing out condoms has instead focused on encouraging fidelity and abstinence... which is exactly the position offeredby the pope on the matter. As for the matters of homosexuality and abortion, it's a similar matter. To try to separate sex from its underlying purpose is immoral and culturally damaging. The damage done can be seen in the demographics of some of the more liberal mations in Europe where birth rates have plummetted and the young and wroking are outnumbered by the retired and convalescing. To embrace sex as self-expression is to embrace a present-tense lifestyle that can pervasively damage an entire civilation if practiced on a large enough scale. Additionally, in the abortion argument, it is not difficult to understand that some people believe life begins at conception, and is therefore immoral to end (In fact, it's a pretty big sin within Christianity, as I'm sure everyone is aware). But the argument of when life begins is completely moot because and abortion would never need to occur if the individuals involved held the proper respect for the act of sex. Say what you will, I think he was onto something there, and I personally detest the church. -------------------- signature
Posts: 2844 | From: the edge of forever | Registered: Jun 1999 | IP: Logged
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Wolfie
Sarge
Member # 1698
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posted 04-06-2005 01:50 PM
I have never thought of the (late) Pope as one of the greatest men of the 20th century, there are others (Gandhi?) who have done similar jobs, but I do agree that he has helped the world a lot.Willy, I read your argument with interest and general agreement, but why is plummeting birth rates a bad thing? Surely this is to be encouraged and strived to by nations like India if we want a sustainable population, i.e. a population that won't use up all the world's resources. Personally as a 20 year old female of asian descent but living in the western world I am not planning to have any children, though I know I might change my mind in the future. -------------------- Draw a crazy picture,
Write a nutty poem,
Sing a mumble-grumble song,
Whistle through your comb.
Do a loony-goony dance
'Cross the kitchen floor,
Put something silly in the world
That ain't been there before.
-Put Something In, Shel Silverstein
Posts: 786 | From: Cold place that rains all the time | Registered: Jan 2000 | IP: Logged
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posted 04-05-2005 11:38 PM
